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RAY
WROTE: "One of the most stinging criticisms made against Christians is that their minds are narrow and their hearts small." (A Tozer - The Root of the Righteous, p113) Who are the so-called "Jews" of today? A reasonable question answered from reason and historic fact B'ANN WROTE: Because this WRAPPER has a lengthy discourse upon this subject, which shows that he has given a lot of thought to the matter, I will answer "up front" if you pleasethen give the remainder of this WRAP to his research. Don will insert his comments at the points where he wants to respond to Ray's opinions.The promise to Father Abraham was simply this:
The Scripture account does not teach that the Israelites were the "apple of God's eye." Christ was always the "Apple of His Eye." In the Bible, the Hebrew Children were no more wonderful, intelligent, exalted, blessed, or adored than any other peoples on the earth. They were to be God's "packet/pouch/clay storage vessel" if you please. They were to carry the Seed which the Book of Galatians plainly states was simply Christ. Now just consider the job of a packet/pouch/clay storage vessel for seeds. Would it not be unbelievably stupid if the packet/pouch/clay storage vessel began to boast about itself? The packet/pouch/clay storage vessel cannot do anything but be container for the seed. First of all, it has to be made or formed by someone's hands. It cannot sprout or grow! It has to be carried by something because it cannot walk! It cannot talk, sing, chant perhaps the packet can be used as a marker at the end of the row to identify the type of plant that will emerge. Christ was always the seed they were to carry--these Israelites of old. In this context, we can see how ridiculous and futile was the exaltation the Israelites gave themselves. They didn't carry the Seed of Promise, they cast it away as useless and established their traditions instead--that totally excluded God. Furthermore, they no longer are the "chosen" of God, but will become the "elect" through acceptance of Christ. Setting Israel up as a Theocracy on earth with God as its governing head is no longer an option. The government will be upon the shoulders of Jesus. God will set up a new kingdom, which will have Jesus listed as the undisputed King, and this kingdom will not be gained by any human effort. It can only be entered by faith in Jesus and He will be called the Lion of Judah and rule with "a rod of Iron".
I submit that the Christians are not narrow and small of heart. These Scriptures embrace the whole world. Christians are not, however, a doormat to be stepped on. They are to have humility. Christ had true humility and yet He said of Himself, "I am the only begotten Son of God." That sounded like a blasphemous boast to the narrow, religious leaders during His time on earth. Leaders that had NO LOVE of God in their hearts. If perchance there had been any measure of love, God would not have had to send His Son to die on the cross; but as with there being 10 righteous in Sodom and Gomorrah, that was not the case. (See Gen. 18:20-32.) God sent His Son to bring the gift of love to a world that was devoid of love. He had given the world the gift of fatherhood during the Old Testament. It is as if He said to Christ, "We created them, they are only created beings, so we are not just unless we give them a way of escape" He felt he had to "justify" Himself, to show His great love to all His offspring, by sending His Eldest Son.. Consider that!
Now Let's read Ray's Comments. The word Jew comes from a Greek word meaning descendent of the tribe of Judah, or someone living in the land of Judea. Today's Jews call themselves Jews to falsely imply that they are somehow descendent from the Biblical tribe of Judah. When asked the question, "Who is Israel? - Who is a Jew?" the Israeli Government's Ministry of Foreign Affairs (MFA) unhesitatingly answered thus: "The term Israelite is purely Biblical. An Israeli is a citizen of Israel, regardless of religion. A Jew is a person anywhere in the world born to a Jewish mother, or converted to Judaism, who is thus identified as a member of the Jewish people and religion. Information Division, Ministry of Foreign Affairs, Jerusalem." (E-mail: ask@israel-info.gov.il - Web:http://www.israel-mfa.gov.il [Feb/1998]) Although linking the term "Israelite" with the Bible, (as a throwaway line) the Jews themselves openly admit that the term "Israelite" or "Jew" has nothing whatsoever to do with the Noahatic bloodline. In fact under the heading "A Brief History of the Terms for Jew," in the 1980 Jewish Almanac, is the following incredible admission: "Strictly speaking it is incorrect to call an ancient Israelite a "Jew" or to call a contemporary Jew an Israelite or a Hebrew". Did you fully comprehend what you just read? .if not, read it again! A JEW IS NOT TO BE CONSIDERED AN ISRAELITE! DON WROTE:I've heard this argument before; and it still holds no water. As to the ancient Hebrews not being Jews, this was true under kings Saul, David and Solomon when they all were considered to be Israelites--thus named after Jacob whose name was changed by God to Israel, meaning "one who prevails with God." (Gen. 32:28) But the same rebellious spirit that caused Abraham's descendants to reject a theocracy (being ruled by God) in favor of a monarchy like the Gentile (i.e., someone having no covenant with God) nations around them soon caused the Hebrew children to turn on one another. After Solomon's rule, the Hebrew nation split into two warring factions. Ten tribes of the north unified and were known as Israel. The other two tribes, the tribes of Judah and Benjamin, were known as Judah--their people being called Jews. If you will study the usage of the terms Israelites and Jews in the New Testament (including the Words of Jesus), you will find that there is no visible pattern to their use. Their use seems to be interchangeable. It's as though God refused to sanction their division into two nations. So contrary to what you write, it seems that in the New Testament, a Jew is considered to be an Israelite, and vice versa. RAY WROTE:Interestingly enough, an "Israeli" is one (no matter what his "religious persuasion") who is now living in the literal nation of Israel, is one who merely follows the Jewish religion. A "Jewish mother" is simply a mother who is identified as a follower of that particular religion. Obviously, anyone can become an "Israeli" by moving to that Palestinian nation, and/or can become a "Jew" simply by CONVERSION to Judaism. In the Bible, Israelite/Jewish lineage is traced through the father and not the mother, e.g., Jesus is referred to as the "Son" of David (a father). The lineages given in Scripture are always from the father, never the mother. It therefore stands to reason that there can be no such thing as "The Jewish People" as can there be no more a "Mormon People" or a Jehovah's Witness" people. They are simply JEWS, with admittedly little relation if any to the Biblical peoples as such. DON WROTE: It has always been true that people could embrace the Hebrew teachings and become Hebrews, be they referred to as Jews or Israelites. In fact, that was part of God's plan when He established the Hebrew nation. They were to evangelize their neighbors. (It was never God's will for them to turn in on themselves and become high-minded and racist, considering those outside of themselves as dogs.). But this in no way takes away from the fact that there were, there are, and there always will be a remnant of people on this earth with some of Abraham's DNA in their veins with whom God will keep his promises to Father Abraham. As to the lineages in the Bible never including the mother, check out the lineage given in the first chapter of the Gospel of Matthew.
As to the following quotes you've included, frankly, I'm not familiar with any of them. Maybe that shows my ignorance. But they do not impress me; and I see no reason to put any confidence in them if their use contradicts the Scriptures. It appears to me that you have taken the writings of many different people and presented them as truths. Remember, journalistic writings can be narrative, expository, persuasive and amongst all this wordiness, they can be "slanted." You need to do your own research and not merely copy the writings of others. These writings seem to talk about the religion of Judaism, not about the original nation mentioned in the Bible. Please don't confuse Judaism with Old Testament righteousness put forth by God. RAY WROTE:What Ethnicity is a Jew? Benjamin Freeman, Facts Are Facts: "CHAZARS: A people of Turkish origin whose life and history are interwoven with the very beginnings of the history of the Jews of Russia...driven on by the nomadic tribes of the steppes and by their own desire for plunder and revenge... In the second half of the sixth century the Chazars moved westward...The kingdom of the Chazars was firmly established in most of south Russia long before the foundation of the Russian monarchy by the Varangians...At this time the kingdom of the Chazars stood at the height of its power and was constantly at war...At the end of the eighth century...the chagan (king) of the Chazars and his grandees, together with a large number of his heathen people, embraced the Jewish religion" Encyclopedia Americana (1985): "Khazar, an ancient Turkic-speaking people who ruled a large and powerful state in the steppes North of the Caucasus Mountains from the 7th century to their demise in the mid- 11th century A.D...In the 8th Century it's political and religious head...as well as the greater part of the Khazar nobility, abandoned paganism and converted to Judaism..." Encyclopedia Britannica (15th edition): "Khazars, confederation of Turkic and Iranian tribes that established a major commercial empire in the second half of the 6th century, covering the SouthEastern section of modern European Russia...In the middle of the 8th century the ruling classes adopted Judaism as their religion." Academic American Encyclopedia (1985): "Ashkenazim, the Ashkenazim are one of the two major divisions of the Jews, the other being the Shephardim." Encyclopedia Americana (1985): "Ashkenazim, the Ashkenazim are the Jews whose ancestors lived in German lands...it was among Ashkenazi Jews that the idea of political Zionism emerged, leading ultimately to the establishment of the state of Israel...In the late 1960s, Ashkenazi Jews numbered some 11 million, about 84 percent of the world Jewish population." The Jewish Encyclopedia: "Khazars, a non-Semitic, Asiatic, Mongolian tribal nation who emigrated into Eastern Europe about the first century, who were converted as an entire nation to Judaism in the seventh century by the expanding Russian nation which absorbed the entire Khazar population, and who account for the presence in Eastern Europe of the great numbers of Yiddish-speaking Jews in Russia, Poland, Lithuania, Galatia, Besserabia and Rumania." The Encyclopedia Judaica (1972): "Khazars, a national group of general Turkic type, independent and sovereign in Eastern Europe between the seventh and tenth centuries C.E. during part of this time the leading Khazars professed Judaism...In spite of the negligible information of an archaeological nature, the presence of Jewish groups and the impact of Jewish ideas in Eastern Europe are considerable during the Middle Ages. Groups have been mentioned as migrating to Central Europe from the East often have been referred to as Khazars, thus making it impossible to overlook the possibility that they originated from within the former Khazar Empire." The Universal Jewish Encyclopedia: "Khazars, a medieval people, probably related to the Volga Bulgars, whose ruling class adopted Judaism during the 8th cent. The Khazars seem to have emerged during the 6th cent., from the vast nomadic Hun (Turki) empire which stretched from the steppes of Eastern Europe and the Volga basin to the Chinese frontier. Although it is often claimed that allusions to the Khazars are found as early as 200 C.E., actually they are not mentioned until 627...most Jewish historians date the conversion of the Khazar King to Judaism during the first half of this century {A.D.}..." The primary meaning of Ashkenaz and Ashkenazim in Hebrew is Germany and Germans. This may be due to the fact that the home of the ancient ancestors of the Germans is Media, which is the Biblical Ashkenaz...Krauss is of the opinion that in the early medieval ages the Khazars were sometimes referred to as Ashkenazim...About 92 percent of all Jews or approximately 14,500,000 are Ashkenazim. The Bible relates that the Khazar (Ashkenaz) Jews were/are the sons of Japheth not Shem: "Now these are the generations of the sons of Noah, Shem, Ham, and Japheth: and unto them were sons born after the flood. The sons of Japheth;...the sons of Gomer; Ashkenaz..." So the Bible verifies that the Ashkenaz Jews [Khazars] are not the descendants of Shem and cannot be Semitic. The American People's Encyclopedia for 1954 at 15-292 records the following in reference to the Khazars: "In the year 740 A.D. the Khazars were officially converted to Judaism. A century later they were crushed by the incoming Slavic-speaking people and were scattered over central Europe where they were known as Jews. It is from this grouping that most German, Polish and Hungarian Jews are descended, and they likewise make up a considerable part of that population now found in America. The term Aschenazim is applied to this round-headed, dark-complexioned division." There are many, many publications we could quote but from the above, we can clearly see that the Jews fully understand their Khazarian heritage as the third edition of The Jewish Encyclopedia for 1925 records: "CHAZARS [Khazars]: A people of Turkish origin whose life and history are interwoven with the very beginnings of the history of the Jews of Russia. The kingdom of the Chazars was firmly established in most of South Russia long before the foundation of the Russian monarchy by the Varangians (855). Jews have lived on the shores of the Black and Caspian seas since the first centuries of the common era [after the death of Christ]. Historical evidence points to the region of the Ural as the home of the Chazars. Among the classical writers of the Middle Ages they were known as the 'Chozars,' 'Khazirs,' 'Akatzirs,' and 'Akatirs,' and in the Russian chronicles as 'Khwalisses' and 'Ugry Byelyye.'..." jews. The jews of today are not the Israelites of the Old Testament. The jews of Judaism today are Khazars, Edomites, Babylonians and Canaanites not the decedents of Jacob/Israel. They follow the Babylonian Talmud not the Christian Old Testament Canonized Books of the Bible. They follow the tradition of the elders of Zion which Jesus Christ so despised! DON WROTE: Granted, it may very well be hard to find a 100% true, blue Hebrew who can trace his ancestry back to Abraham. But that is not surprising nor earthshaking. God himself was guilty of watering down the Hebrew lineage by bringing Gentile women full of faith (i.e., Ruth the Moabite) into the main bloodlines leading up to Christ Jesus. In fact, the Apostle Paul, though he was only part Jew, presented himself as a Hebrew as well as a Roman citizen. Also, it shouldn't be surprising that those who live in Israel like to be known as Israelites. It is common practice for people to associate themselves with the belief that is prevalent in their nation. For example, many people in the U.S. will tell you that their heritage as an American makes them a "Christian." Another example of this would be the Catholics and Christians in Ireland. From their behavior, it is apparent that the war-like elements in this war-torn land use these terms to identify their political party--not their spiritual status. But I fail to see what all this has to do with anything. RAY WROTE: What is Cabbalism? Cabbala, Kaballah, Quabalah, and Qabal are all reference of what is commonly referred to as "Jewish (Gnostic) Mysticism." Jews believe that the Hebrew Moseretic Version of the Torah was written by God [Tetragrammaton] himself, prior to the creation. They believe that when Moses went to the top of Mt. Sinai, God gave Him the written Torah as well as oral instructions for Cabbalism. The primary written document concerning Cabbalism is the Zohar, which is contained in the Jewish Talmud. Kaballah texts are only written in their original Hebrew, so non-Jews hopefully cannot read them. Jews believe that King Solomon was the first great Cabbalist who developed rituals for controlling Demonic and angelic forces. Jewish Cabbalists believe that there are 33 steps to attaining spiritual perfection. Through disciplined study of Cabbalism, Jews believe that they may eventually see God and become his intellectual equal. In the Jewish Talmud, a famous Cabbalistic Rabbi debates God, where God admits the Rabbi has beaten Him (YHWH, GOD). (A highly unlikely scenario, only a Jew would have the audacity to think he could outwit the Most High.) Jews also believe that through Cabbalism, they can perform the miracles of Jesus Christ. In this fashion, they can themselves become individual Christs (their own Messiahs) through spiritual perfection. "The Jewish people as a whole will become its own Messiah. It will attain world dominion by the dissolution of other races, by the abolition of frontiers, the annihilation of monarchy and by the establishment of a world republic in which the Jews will everywhere exercise the privilege of citizenship. In this New World Order the children of Israel will furnish all the leaders without encountering opposition. The Governments of the different peoples forming the world republic will fall without difficulty into the hands of the Jews. It will then be possible for the Jewish rulers to abolish private property and everywhere to make use of the resources of the state. Thus will the promise of the Talmud be fulfilled, in which is said that when the Messianic time is come, the Jews will have all the property of the whole world in their hands." -Baruch Levy, Letter to Karl Marx, 'La Revue de Paris', p.574, June 1, 1928 Note:- Messiah = Christ DON WROTE: I've never heard of the term Caballism and I'm quite sure I have no need to hear of it again. Also, I'm afraid that you use the term facts rather loosely. RAY WROTE: More Facts and Quotes that are easily verified: Judaism is NOT the religion of the Bible. "This is not an uncommon impression and one finds it sometimes among Jews as well as Christians -that Judaism is the religion of the Hebrew bible. It is, of course, a fallacious impression. Judaism is not the religion of the Bible." (Rabbi Ben Zion Boskser, Judaism and the Christian Predicament, pp 59, 159. Judaism began in Babylon. "The return from Babylon, and the adoption of the Babylonian Talmud, marks the end of Hebrewism and the beginning of Judaism." (Rabbi Steven Samuel Wise). Judaism is based on the Babylonian Talmud, not the Bible. "When we come to the Babylonian Gemara, we are dealing with what most people understand when they speak or write of the Talmud. Its birthplace, Babylonia, was an autonomous Jewish centre for a longer period than any other land; namely, from soon after 586 before the Christian era to the year 1040 after the Christian era - 1626 years, from the days of Cyrus down to the age of the Mongol conquerors!" (Chief Rabbi Joseph Herman Hertz, The Babylonian Talmud, pp, xiii. The Babylonian Talmud, the sole authority of Judaism. "The Talmud derives its authority from the position held by the ancient academies. The teachers of those academies, both of Babylonia and of Palestine, were considered the rightful successors of the older Sanhedrins or the later academies. Therefore, any decision regarding the Jewish religion must be based on the Talmud as the final resume of the teaching of those authorities when they existed." (Rabbi Louis Finklestein, The Jews - Their History, Culture, and Religion, volume 4, pp. 1332. After 70 AD, Judaism was controlled by the Pharisees. "In King Agrippa (41-44 AD) the Pharisees had a supporter and friend, and with the destruction of the Temple the Sadducees disappeared altogether, leaving the regulation of all Jewish affairs in the hands of the Pharisees. Henceforth Jewish life was regulated by the teachings of the Pharisees; the whole history of Judaism was reconstructed from the Pharisaic point of view, and a new aspect was given to the Sanhedrin of the past. A new chain of tradition supplanted the older, priestly tradition. Pharisaism shaped the character of Judaism and the life and thought of the Jew for all the future." (The Jewish Encyclopedia, "Pharisees," pp. 666). Modern day Judaism is the religion of the ancient Pharisees. "Pharisaism became Talmudism, Talmudism became medieval Rabbinism, and medieval Rabbinism became modern Rabbinism. But throughout these changes of name, inevitable adaptation of custom, and adjustment of Law, the spirit of the ancient Pharisee survives unaltered." (Rabbi Louis Finkelstein, The Pharisees, The Sociological Background of Their Faith, pp. Xxi). Judeo-Christian tradition is a fantasy. "Judaism is Judaism because it rejects Christianity, and Christianity is Christianity because it rejects Judaism. What is usually referred to as the Judeo-Christian tradition exists only in Christian or secularist fantasy. As far as the Jews are concerned, Judaism is fully sufficient. There is nothing in Christianity for them." (Rabbi Eliezer Barkovits, Judaism in the Post-Christian Era, pp. 80). Judaism sprang forth from Babylon and during the time of Jesus, the Pharisees were the enemy of both Jesus and His followers. If Pharisaism was the source of enmity toward Christianity in the first century, is it surprising that Judaism is the source of hatred toward true Christianity in the present time? "The Jew is not satisfied with de-Christianising, he Judaizes, he destroys both Catholic and Protestant faith alike, he provokes indifference, but he imposes his ideas of the world, of morals, and of life upon those whose faith he ruins; he (the Jew) works at his age-old task, the annihilation of the religion of Christ." - Bernard Lazare, 'L'Antisemitisme', p.350 "The Jews in Russia, in their total mass, were responsible for the Revolution." - Angelo S. Rappaport, 'The Pioneers of the Russian Revolution', P. 250, Stanely, Paul and Co., London 1918 "Some call it Marxism - I call it Judaism." - Rabbi Stephen S. Wise, 'The American Bulletin', May 15, 1935 "There is much in the fact of Bolshevism itself, in the fact that so many Jews are Bolshevists. The ideals of Bolshevism are consonant with many of the highest ideals of Judaism." - 'Jewish Chronicle', London, April 4, 1919 "The Bolshevist revolution in Russian was the work of Jewish brains, of Jewish dissatisfaction, of Jewish planning, whose goal is to create a new order in the world. What was performed in so excellent a way in Russia, shall also, through the same Jewish mental and physical forces, become a reality all over the world." -' The American Hebrew', Sept 10, 1920 "The image of the world in 1987 as traced in my imagination - the increasing influence of the farmers and workers, and the rising political influence of men of science, may transform the United States into a welfare state with a planned economy. Western and Eastern Europe will become a federation of autonomous states having a socialist and democratic regime. With the exception of the USSR as a federated Eurasian state, all other continents will become united in a world alliance, at whose disposal will be an international police force. All armies will be abolished, and there will be no more wars. In Jerusalem, the United Nations (a truly United Nations) will build a shrine of the Prophets to serve the federated union of all continents; this will be the seat of the Supreme Court of Mankind, to settle all controversies among the federated continents." - David Ben Gurion "The great ideal of Judaism is that the whole world shall be imbued with Jewish teachings, and that in a Universal Brotherhood of nations -- a greater Judaism in fact -- all the Separate races and religions shall disappear." - The Jewish World, Feb 9, 1883 "The Jews, are a people - one people. When we sink, we become revolutionary proletariat, the subordinate officers of a revolutionary party;when we rise, there arises also our terrible power of the purse." - Theodor Herzl, 'The Jewish State', 1896 "With gold we buy the most rebellious consciences, can subsidise all state loans, and thereafter hold the states at our mercy. Already the principal banks, the exchanges of the entire world, the credits of all the governments, are in our hands." - Rabbi Reichorn "We Jews, who have posed as Saviours of the World, we are today nothing else but the world's seducers, its destroyers, its incendiaries, its executioners." - Oscar Levy "I am devoting my lecture in this seminar to a discussion of the possibility that we are now entering a Jewish Century. A time when the spirit of the community, the non-ideological blend of the emotional and rational and the resistance to categories and forms will emerge through the forces of anti-nationalism to provide us with a new kind of society. I call this process the Judaization of Christianity because Christianity will be the vehicle through which this society becomes Jewish." - Rabbi Martin Siegel, 'New York Magazine', p.32, Jan. 18, 1972. Judaism is not, nor ever has been the religion of the Old Testament. Judaism was/is a newly formalized belief system of the Pharisees, which arose in Babylon with the commitment of the oral "tradition of the elders" to writing after the destruction of the Temple in A.D. 70. Judaism is a man-made religion of Talmudic tradition and Kabbalistic superstition, which represents the institutionalized nullification of Biblical law and doctrine. Judaism's God is not the God of the Bible, but the strange gods of their Talmud and Kabbalah and the racial self-worship they inculcate. Scripture must always be interpreted in the light of Historic Truth DON WROTE: I agree with your statement that Judaism is not and has never been a religion ordained of God. Once again, I'm not familiar with or impressed by your authorities. And I strongly disagree with your statement that "Scripture must always be interpreted in the light of Historic Truth." To me, it is just the opposite. History must be interpreted in the light of the Scriptures before it should be labeled as truth. RAY WROTE: Now ask yourself the following questions and honestly answer in your own mind from what you now suspect to be the truth. 1). Have the Jews been a blessing to all nations? 2). Have the Jews been "Circumcised In The Heart?" 3). Do the Jews glorify Jesus Christ? 4). Do the Jews declare that Jesus is God? 5). Do the Jews show forth the praises of Christ, God's Son? 6). Have the Jews carried the message of "personal" and "national" Salvation to the ends of the Earth? 7). Do the Jewish people have God's Spirit in their hearts? 8). Was the New Covenant (Testament) written to Jews OR ISRAELITES and what is the difference between the two? 9). Are the Jews the "lost sheep of the house of Israel?" 10). Are the Jews the "children of God, scattered abroad?" 11). Are the Jews the servants of God? 12). Are the Jews a Holy Nation and People? 13). Are there any Jews mentioned in the "faith chapter" of Hebrews 11? 14). Are the Jews a righteous nation? 15). Are the Jews bringing forth the fruits of God's Kingdom? 16). Are the Jews kind to strangers in their midst? 17). Are the Jews called the "children of the living God?" 18). Do the Jews admit that they are not God's People? 19). Do the Jews have all of God's Word? 20). Are the Jews a Great and Mighty Nation? 21). Do the Jews possess the "gates of their enemies?" 22). Are the Jews a "company of nations?" 23). Are the Jews above all people in moral excellence? 24). Are the Jews today called through Isaac? 25). Have the Jews ever lost their identity? 26). Have the Jews ever been called by a "new name?" 27). Are the major heathen nations aligned against the Jews alone? 28). Are the modern day Jews described as "a great lion?" 29). Did the Jews deliver Jerusalem from the power of the heathen? 30). Has the Jewish "people" ever had the name of "Great?" 31). Have the Jews been great colonizers? 32). Do the Jews recognise Jesus as Messiah? 33). Will you continue to teach that the "Jews are ALL of Israel?" 34). Have the Jews been foremost in ending slavery? DON WROTE: From the tenure of your questions, it seems to me that you need to spend more time in the Bible and less time in studying your experts. Anyone who has spent any quality time in the Scriptures knows that your questions are really a waste of time, for the Bible teaches that the Israelites (the Jews or the Hebrews--whatever title you choose to use) have been blinded by God and can do nothing at this point in time to please Him except to accept Christ Jesus as their Messiah and their personal Savior.
But the Bible also says that this will not always be the case with Israel. If you're interested in my understanding of the role that the end-time Jew will play in the later-day happenings, then go our home page and click on our on-line book, THE CLOCK OF THE AGES. RAY WROTE: As a matter of fact, with reference to the last item (34) above did you know that presently, (July 2000) Israel is the centre of the World's White slave trade dealing in young Eastern European girls as young as 10 years old? These are the slimes that Christendom attributes the title "God's Chosen People". DON WROTE: I don't know your source for making such a statement, but I'm sure that our State Department would like to have it. If this is just hearsay, shame on you. We have houses of prostitution in our country, as does most any country on the globe. Can we say their prostitution is bad and ours is good just because President Roosevelt outlawed white slavery? Visit some of the U.S. street corners before throwing stones at another nation. RAY WROTE: Do not I hate them, O Lord, that hate thee? and am I not grieved with those that rise up against thee? I hate them with perfect hatred: I count them mine enemies. (Ps: 139:21,22) DON WROTE: True, this was the heart of the warrior David under the dispensation of the Law of Moses. But Jesus procured for us a New Testament and made it effectual by the shedding of His own blood. If you are a follower of Christ, then you are bound to the New Law of the Spirit of Truth in Christ Jesus which would have you loving your enemy and doing good unto them.
(To our Cyber-Visitors: Ray shot us back another WRAP.) RAY WROTE AGAIN: THE most fundamental mistake that is made by most Christians today,
including you Don, is synonymising the terms JEW and ISRAEL. They are
simply NOT synonymous terms and are the reason for so much confusion in
Evangelical circles today. In summary: DON WROTE AGAIN: I applaud you for your research; and for your brief summary which to me is very clear. I've never heard it any clearer. Your point that you're making: i.e., Those who interchange the words "Jew" and Israelite, call Abraham a Jew, even though Abraham was not even an Israelite, and the word "Jew" is not used in the Bible until 1,000 years AFTER Abraham is well taken. It brings to mind the persuasion of the Apostle Paul concerning the Sadducees' and Pharisees' misplaced confidence in the practice of circumcision.
Paul presented his argument trying to convince the Jews who were refusing their Messiah, and the eternal life that He had secured for them, in hopes of saving their souls from an eternity of damnation. His point was that those who were trusting in the ritual of circumcision, rather than the faith of their Father Abraham, were in error because Abraham had been counted to be righteous by faith years before circumcision was given. But I'm having trouble with the purpose of your stance unless it is just that you like all the pictures hung straight. As I read the Scriptures, the two main players in prophecy are the two entities who claim Abraham as their father: i.e., those who claim to be of his seed via the earthy bloodline and those who claim to be his of his seed through faith in Christ. For the purposes of prophecy, I see no value in splitting hairs over which name is used to identify those who claim to be of Abraham through the flesh. Granted, it is technically incorrect to say that Abraham is of his worldly seed which is what one is doing when they say that Abraham is a Jew or an Israelite. And from this day forward, I will take care not to make that mistake. Thanks for WRAPPING with us. Don B'ANN WROTE: When the Age of Grace was ushered in, the new prescription for salvation was faith in God's only begotten Son.
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